Episode 02

 

 

Leah: Welcome to SexReimagined! Today, we have for you an enlightening episode, all about what is spiritual sex 

Willow: and what can you do with it? 

Leah: Yeah, we go over a lot of really juicy pieces. We talk about some of our own experiences growing up in a religious household and what we needed to transcend in order to bring sex into, or actually to bring spirituality into our sex lives.

Willow: Yeah. And the journeys that we both have been through, are the same, but different, very unique. And you'll probably will be able to relate to both of them and you'll be like, oh, I had a little bit of this and a little bit of that. So, you might wanna take some notes on this too. 

We talk about, you know, the different aspects, the different pieces that make up a spiritual sexual encounter with.

Leah: We talk about what you can do to create a more spiritual experience in love making. And that includes everything from creating a prayer, and invocation of an intention. you're gonna have a lot of things to draw on that will relate to your value system. We talk about trust and vulnerability and why stillness is, and slowness are so powerful and experiencing more of a mystical experience.

Willow: Absolutely. You are going to love this episode. You're gonna get so much out of it and we cannot wait to hear what questions or what comments you have after you listen to this. So be sure to let us know. Yeah. 

Leah: We wanna know about your sacred sex experiences. So please don't hold back on us, you know better.

Willow: Welcome to the sex reimagined podcast, where sex is shame free and pleasure forward. Let's get into the show. 

[00:02:09] EPISODE STARTS HERE

Leah: Well, well, well, What is spiritual sex? 

Willow: Well, well, well, I don't know. Let's talk about what that is. Let's talk about it. Spiritual sex. Oh, there's so many different kinds of sex to be had, really, in the world.

I'd have to say spiritual sex is probably my most favorite, um, because it touches a deeper part of me as a human being. Yeah. Not just as a woman. I don't know if it's women who crave this more, or just people who are seekers. I'm not sure, but it does seem that it's much more satisfactory to all who are involved when there is a spiritual connection, and you're using that sexual vitality, that sexual energy to create a higher level of consciousness.

Leah: Yeah, I think there's all sorts of reasons. Why people crave that deeper, more spiritual kind of heartfelt, connected intimacy. I think we all sometimes come from different lenses as to how we get there. 

[00:03:20] Religious Upbringing and it's influence on Sexual Shame & Fear

Leah: For me personally, I had a lot of spiritual and religious confusion growing up as a kid. So started off in a Pentecostal Conservative family.

My parents were kind of like hippies that went to Jesus. You know, I think they did too many drugs and then got scared and then started having a family and without, oh shit, we better go shit together. So they found God, they were hippies for Jesus, baby, and they were young. They were in their early, early twenties when they started having kids and finding God.

And it was a really deeply impactful time in their life. But with that indoctrination of such a conservative view into religion, man did it come with a lot of guilt, fear and 

Willow: shame? Oh my God. Raise your hand. If you are recovering Christian or Catholic, especially in the sexuality realm. I mean, and maybe you're still into to those religions and yeah.

God bless. There's nothing. That's great. Yeah. But if you're covering from that in a sexual perspective, in a relation, in a relationship way so that you don't, you're not carrying all the shame and the guilt that comes with those particular religions and many, many other religions as well.

I, yeah, it seems to me that the reason and not to, to go too far down the religion rabbit hole, but it seems to me that a lot of the reason why religions have squashed or, you know, made sex to be like, keep it down under is because it's so damn powerful. Like it's such a powerful force that we all have access to.

And if we know how to utilize that power, I mean, we can do anything in the world. Nothing can stop us. It's really an incredible, it's like, it's the magic of life in my opinion, my not so humble opinion. And you know, when it's stuck under the shame and under the guilt and under all of the suppressive things that not only religion, but society at large puts on top of it, we lose that magical part of ourselves.

Leah: You know, it's interesting you use the word magical because that was a bad word growing up in my family. Interesting. We weren't allowed to watch the SMIS because, oh yes. You know, there's these, all those magical qualities like magic was really sinful. Mm-hmm, isn't that interesting. And so, and then, you know, to add more confusion to the soup, my parents left that church when I was 10 or 11, and I was really upset.

I was kind of borderline suicidal because I loved that church. Wow. It was a huge sense of community. There was such of singing. I knew everyone in the neighborhood. It was like a big deal to me. It was felt like my family, I didn't understand why we were leaving, but they left. I think, because they were noticing some corrupt mishandling of money.

Okay. And you, you there's, that's a long story. We'll do a whole episode on like the religious recovery as it relates to sexuality. But the reason why it's important for me and my story is because I did grow up feeling very close to the teachings of what God was. And I remember my mom in the bath, I was in the bathtub one night, and it was like having my own little baptism with my mom.

And do you accept Jesus Christ into your heart and was like this whole thing and, you know, take away the words and the language and Jesus, I really felt like what I was saying at five years old, the memory is so crystal clear is I believe in something. I believe in something bigger and more powerful than me, and like the sense of peace and joy was really, I really felt it like it was in me, I think as confusing.

And as much as that particular time in my life fucked me up sexually, the gift it gave me was a sense of spirituality was an autonomous and sovereign relationship between me and spirit that it was individual, and it was personal. And I didn't need anyone else to have that relationship. Like I just, my mom and still that truth into my being that night and then nurtured it on and on and on.

And so it was, why this idea of how can that be separate from sex? 

Willow: Right. The 

Leah: emerge that I feel in the bottom, so horny, like how could that be separate from, from God? I just, it wasn't 

Willow: congruent. Didn't make sense. Absolutely. Yeah. I can absolutely relate to that. I had the opposite experience where I.

Growing up and going to Catholic church every single Sunday and doing all the catechism and all that stuff. I just, in my mind and heart, I was like, this is some bullshit. That is not for me. God bless if it's for someone else, but for me, it's not my path, and it's, it's not. Something that I'm gonna carry on when I get to make my own choices in the world.

But I also was grateful that it gave that I grew up later on I was grateful that I did have that in my life because it did give me this sense of spirituality. This sense of, okay, I'm not alone on this path. Like I've got spirit behind me. I've got this, Dow is what I call it now, you know, I've got this universal connection supporting me that I can align with that I can find my state of congruence with, and it will support whatever I am desiring or calling forth into my life in its own unique way.

Of course, when sexuality came online for me, I mean, fortunately, my mom was a nurse, is a nurse. And so she was more like, okay, you're starting to have your period. You're starting to have these urges. All right. And she bust out the anatomy book, you know, so that's probably what took me down. The practitioner track, you know, was just like early on, like looking at this stuff from a, a scientific physiological point of view as well.

But it wasn't super shamed. It was just almost kind of more not talked about, you know, so, oh yeah. 

Leah: Mine was totally shamed. You know, I think my mom had four daughters, has four daughters. And I just remember her saying, like, if I can just get through all of you through high school without getting pregnant, if you can just all, just don't do it.

It's not worth it. Trust me, spread your it's. It's not even that fun. And my dad is looking at her going, Kate, how can you say, it's not fun

Willow: watching these two 

Leah: mixed messages. And I'm also feeling what I'm feeling in my body Uhhuh. And I was alive. I mean, I remember being very tingly and alive since a toddler. I mean, it is, it doesn't just wake up in you when you're 13, and you can get your period. We are sexually alive from the moment we're born.

Mm-hmm and we've all this fear about UN somebody underage feeling any of. And that just contributes to the fear and the feeling of danger. And we've gotta protect, protect, protect, especially our daughters. And it's just like, it was so overwhelming this like virginal protection, like non-permissive go have a great time be sexually all that you can be.

I mean, I would've loved that message. I would've loved somebody saying here's all the ways you can have sex without getting pregnant. 

Willow: You know what an, what a gift that would, I know if what's 

Leah: a worried about is me getting pregnant. Got it. Get it. Totally understandable. Yeah. Then that's legitimate shit I can do to get off, you know, like, cause I'm going to only, what do you want me to have?

Do you want me to be riddled with guilt and shame or do you in fear or do you want it to be. 

Willow: Man, this is beautiful. And S our hormones are the most alive 

Leah: and here we are trying to prevent ourselves from enjoying it. It could be the best sex of our life as teenagers, but we're so, you know, don't do it.

Don't do it. It's just, well, anyways, that's not really talking about spirituality. That's just been, my first impact was a lot of fear, guilt and shame and danger, and yet horny as hell. And none of it made sense, right? I just did not. There was no sense of truth in it. 

[00:12:11] Leah's first Tantric lover

Leah: And when I was 17, 18 years old, and I got the book Tantra: the Art of Conscious, Loving after the first love of my life, broke up with me.

I was gobsmacked. I couldn't believe that this stuff, we were doing the crazy ass orgasmic, holy shit. Things we were doing were things he learned in a book, cuz I really felt like I was having a spiritual experience. I remember like floating up and out of my body and looking down at this love making wow.

Was building such a connection of like union, and really it was so psychedelic. Wow. Like I was having, I was on acid. It's how it 

Willow: felt. I love that. So you had that early, early on, early sexual experience. That's unusual. Most people don't get that until much, much later in their journey. Yeah. So I mean, I think 

Leah: I just needed the 

Willow: healing so much.

Yeah. So how old were you, what was your first boyfriend? 

Leah: Well, the first boy that I fell in love with, I was a senior in high school, and he was like 32 bongo drummer in a hippie band. 

Willow: oh my God. Of course, he was a paper. I know. That's hilarious. Wait, is he the one who gave you the book? He's 

Leah: the, yes. When he.

Left. He left all of his books with me, and that was one of the books. 

Willow: See that's, that is the beauty of, of going toward older men when you're a younger girl. Yeah. You just also need to yeah. Be cognizant of your cycle and, and getting pregnant and all that stuff. 

[00:13:46] Willow's first Taoist Lover

Willow: Um, but yeah, mine came around 19. I was with somebody for the first time who I was like, why isn't he coming?

Why isn't he having an orgasm? I don't understand. And so I finally asked him, he's like, oh, I'm practicing non-ejaculatory method. And I was like, what the hell are you talking about? And he gave me a book. So I also was young. Not quite as young as you. I know I didn't that. Yeah. And he got me into the Dow, and actually we ended up going to acupuncture school together years later years after that, like we won our separate ways for probably about.

Seven or eight, nine years, and then ended up at the same, you know, five branches, university got our master's there. So how funny is that? No, that is, but I attracted three different men who, who were practitioners of non-ejaculatory Taoist practice. And so that's really what got me into it. And I was just so curious about this, and I traveled to Asia and I read all Monta Chi books.

And I, you know, I sat with Monta Chi and a bunch of other Taoist masters around the world. And just really started to study probably my big peak curiosity and interest in all of this was the health aspect of it and the manifestation power that lies behind it. So, you know, when we are talking.

Spiritual sex. I mean, we could go in a million different directions. You can, I know so many places to visit. You know, you could use it for manifestation. You can use it for health. You can use it for intimacy, for healing, the traumas that you experienced when you were a child. 

[00:15:25] Defining Spiritual Sex

Willow: So how would you define, let's just define it.

Each of us, gimme your definition. Love. I, I think it's what spiritual 

Leah: sex is. It's the mystical experience of love of sexual, spiritual love. Yeah, deeply, emotionally, sexually, and spiritually love to your core. That is a unique experience of love, and it requires a full, open, naked, vulnerable body on every level, all choppers fir.

Willow: I love it. That's a pretty great definition. Yeah. I would just add to that. I mean, I'm just gonna tack on, I'm not gonna change a word of that, but basically I think it's, you know, it's, it's a new level of intimacy. Really, all anyone wants in their life is to be seen and acknowledged, you know, what do we hear all the time from our couples?

He doesn't see me. She doesn't understand me. It's like totally. So intimacy bringing intimacy to a level of, of, of higher consciousness is how I see spiritual sex. And intimacy is made up of trust. So being able to trust yourself first and foremost, cause if you don't trust yourself, you're never gonna trust the other person, but then you need to be able to trust the other person.

And that's missing in so many couples that I work with trust then vulnerability, because if you trust someone it's much easier to be naked and vulnerable and let all, all the parts of yourself that you have been hiding away, a lot of your life come to the table. So trust, vulnerability and presence.

When we can bring those three things together, then we're in a deep state of intimacy. And we, when we can use that intimacy to create a higher level of consciousness in our whole lives, I think that's the beauty of what spiritual sex can bring to your life. 

Leah: Yeah. You know, I think. I think some of the mistakes that I believe people make in intimacy is thinking that in order to trust someone, they have to know all these things about them.

Yeah. You know, it's like, oh, I have to know this, that they have to prove this, that like people withhold trust in intimacy in a very interesting way is if withholding it will somehow make them safer. Right. 

[00:17:53] Seeing the Divine in your Partner

Leah: And my experience in having studied Tantra in the school that I did, one of the first teachings you get is can you see God in this person, 

Willow: every person you don't have 

Leah: to attracted to them.

Right? And so once I realize that if I look for the divine in that person, they become completely desirable and, and physical attraction is like way, way, way in the background. There is something about connecting to somebody's soul. That opens up the door to intimacy and, like, trust is a choice, and it's a door that opens on your side.

That's right. And when you trust yourself, you, you trust in the wisdom of your felt sense. Yeah. You're not gonna go someplace. That's gonna hurt you. 

Willow: It's exactly 

Leah: right. It's really hard to perpetrate against somebody who's powerful. Mm-hmm, how they hold themselves. How they carry themselves, how they respect themselves.

Perpetrators are looking for people who don't have that, right? Because they're easier to prey on. They're not gonna be successful with someone who's done their work and like is super, super clean about their worth. You know, they're not walking down the street with their head down to the ground. They're walking with their shoulders back and.

There's a connection to that and deep, profound sex, because you have to care for yourself to experience the care that someone wants to give to you. I can have really epic, amazing spiritual sex with a what's it called a stranger. That's what they're called, but they don't feel like a stranger. Do they, when you look into their eyes and there is like, holy shit, who are you?

Wow, you're amazing. And so there is a skill of seeing the divine in someone, whether you are dating or whether you are with the same person for 25 years. Absolutely. If you can see the divine in them, then it is a privilege to spend 10 minutes, a half hour, two hours all night making love to them because who you're making love to is God mm-hmm or goddess mm-hmm or some androgynous in between.

Yeah, but whatever turns you on 

Willow: baby. Yeah. Right, exactly. Exactly. Yeah. That is the trick, you know, that is where the magic lies and where that trust builds inside of you is, it's the reflection that you see in someone else's eyes that that's coming from inside of you it's, you are creating all of what is coming to you.

So it doesn't really matter who you're looking into this eyes and into the soul of, if you are coming from that place of divine love, you know, universal love. And so. With spiritual sexuality. There's an opportunity for, for both people, regardless of where they're at on that journey, to go even further, to go even deeper.

And I think that's one of the things that feels, to me, so addicting about it or so exciting and inspiring about spiritual sexuality is every single time you get to expand and evolve even more. And whether it involves sexual intercourse or not is completely irrelevant. Yeah. Whether it involves an orgasm is completely irrelevant.

What's relevant is the presence that you bring to the table with that person and the seeing of them, the seeing of their soul. It is so, so medicinal, these types of sexual experiences can leave a human being reeling for a week and a half, two weeks, three weeks, like for a lifetime, 

Leah: a lifetime. Oh, have I remembered some past experiences they will be with me for, I revisit them.

I, I savor them. I bask and.

Afternoons of delight. 

Willow: Yeah. I mean, blessings to all those out there. Yeah. I mean it, do. And after one of those experiences, don't you feel lighter? Like nothing could go like. Anything that was incongruent inside of your body or disorganized or diseased is the complete opposite, right? Yeah. You know, 

Leah: I forget how Charles used to describe it, but it was like you have these experiences, and they give you a Pearl and you like make this necklace of pearls over a lifetime of these like exquisite experiences of, of deep love, of deep meaning of bodies and minds and hearts.

And you, you actually transcend the body yet. You're still in the body. It's this really mystical, cosmic experience of being so alive in the body that you actually go beyond it, but you're not abandoning it. Mm-hmm it's. And, and there are times when, like the pleasure is so S stupefying it can be so.

Cymbals crashing and making the most incredible orgasmic sound and your body's reverberating, just like, you know, cymbals do when you smash them together. And those are just so unique, and it comes with a certain chemistry that you have with someone else, but it's an ability to see beyond their personality.

It's an ability to just allow this magical electrical thing called our body have its way with each other. Yeah. And I, I'm in a marriage now that's monogamous and long term. And I can't say that those experiences, like I just described, with the cymbals. That's not something that is happens every week.

It doesn't even happen every month. 

[00:23:46] Spiritual, Mystical, Cozy, Comfy, Lazy... all the Sex

Leah: There's a different, sweeter type of love making. That's not quite as. Earth shaking as some of those first spiritual experiences when you're first getting to know someone and they're so cosmic, there is something that transcends, at least it's transcending in my life right now.

And I'm sure that it's gonna continue to evolve and shift and change. Cause we're too creative, committed people, and we're interested in seeking what's new, what's different, and we're also happy being cozy and comfortable. So there's all sorts of different types of sex. The spiritual love making in sex is just one of the sweet ones, but so is a quickie.

It's not to say that like you should only have spiritual sex, right? It's just to say that if you've never had it, you're missing the boat, you're missing something that all bodies deserve to step. Absolutely. And it doesn't have to be religious. I think some people get confused between like spiritual and religious.

Yeah. We could even throw all those two words and just call it mystical, 

Willow: mystical sex. Yeah. I'm liking that. Yeah. And the reality is when you have these like mystical sexual experiences, they then feed the quickies. Right. The quickies become totally different after that. It's just, it's a way of nourishing, like adding to your sexual repertoire or sexual, caldron of what's possible, even when you're, you know, having a quickie or, or a comfy or that's cute or lazy and lazy.

Yeah. Any of these other styles of sex. Yeah. I 

Leah: think also what's interesting distinction regarding spiritual or mystical sex is it tends to be slower. Yeah. Not to say that there aren't like, you know, big, hot friction escalated waves of like major pounding

Willow: Cause that happens in that too. 

Leah: Yeah. There's a place for that baby. But there's, I really love and appreciate, one of the things I think hide most treasure is the language. It's the it's the slow, it's the stretched out. It's the feast. It's not fast food. It's we're gonna sit down. We're gonna feast, you know?

Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's also another piece that makes it different than other types of sex. 

[Willow: Yeah. Yeah. The, the time that you take with it, usually these spiritual sexual encounters are much longer there. Not usually quickies. They can last up to four hours, is my usual max, you know? Yeah. My usual men is like two hours.

So, because you can get lost and, and you're not even again, necessarily having intercourse at all or the whole time, but rather you are exploring, uh, just every little intricate detail of this person on every single level, a spiritual, a physical, a psychological, and an emotional level, and to be seen.

On all four accounts of what it means to be a human being that deeply by another human being is so delightful. So delightful. 

[00:27:11] How to Spiritualize Sex

Willow: So, so for our listeners, like how, what would we give them? Like, how would we direct them and guide them into one of these types of sexual experiences, especially if they've been in a marriage for a long time, or they've never had anything like this and, you know, doing something totally different might make the other person feel inadequate in some way.

I think there's a 

Leah: lot of components that you can add, because I think for a lot of people, especially those that have been in relationship for the whole, for a long time, sex has turned into a habit. And one of the things you wanna consider is what's the difference between a habit and a ritual. Because you can take a habit and ritualize it.

And what that does is it makes it special. So for instance, we all have dinner every night, but when you set the table with a tablecloth, and you've got cloth napkins and you like candles and you dim the lights, and you put on some dinner music, maybe you say grace, now you've got a you know, another example of habit versus ritual would be, we all brush our teeth in the morning.

So sometimes I'll put the toothpaste on Matt's brush and just leave it by the sink. Oh, that is so sweet. Yeah. And then he'll do it for me in the night. It's like this, and we're so get we're like, oh, flirty. Feel like kids. It's so cute. And your boys gets really high and you kind of talk like a baby to each other, cuz you're so cute.

And that is taking something that's a habit and turning it into something special. Yeah. So when you think about sex, same thing applies to sex. If you want to make it special, like the candles, dim the lights, take a Soong and throw it over. You know, like make the space, butty warm up the massage oil and the lubricant put a Tao on the sheet, you know, start with an intention.

And one of the prayers that we often say in Tantra is: 

"I invoke an evoke. God got us United in oneness, so that this be a prayer of our love so that we may know God. And so God may know us through our love making."

Mm-hmm. And so you treat, you treat the actual love making as if it were a prayer to your God, physical prayer to your God.

And so when you invoke, you call the spirit of your spiritual values, whatever you call spirit that resonates with you, you call that inside of you, you invoke it so that it is inside and that it's also inside of your partner. And then you evoke that present into the space, into the room. So that this divine energy is inside of you and also inside the room and inside your partner so that you may know God.

And so God may know you, so your partner becomes God and you become God. And through this experience, You get to know what the divine really is, because from a more non-dualistic perspective, it's there anyways. That's right. And so I think in love making it's a good reminder. That's why I love that prayer so much.

It's a beautiful prayer. It reminds us who we really are anyways. And sometimes we just need to say that out loud. So having an intention, right. And you don't have to use that one. You would just say, "Hey, babe, what do you wanna release from your life that no longer serves you? Name it." Boom. "Hey babe, what do you wanna bring into your life that you would like more of? Let's call it", boom, and, and give your love, making some power.

Send it out to the universe. You have a job. Mm-hmm take this love and do something beautiful with it. Mm-hmm and that's enough to set 

Willow: the tone. Absolutely. Absolutely. That's more than enough to set the tone, you know, and it's really is like setting the environment up, setting the space up, you know, with candles and music and sense and lighting and all of that.

And then having this intention, like just doing that and then starting to go through the motions of, you know, how you guys know how to have sex together, like just going through that. And then at some point you're gonna get carried over this threshold where you enter what Sherry Winston calls, the "trans-state", what I call the "yin field".

What do you call it? Leah? 

Leah: I've named it. I think for me, it's that, it's that high peak state of arousal where you're suspended. Maybe I'll call it the "suspended

Willow: state". Ooh. The suspended state. I love that. Yeah. And so in that state, you are no longer doing, you're no longer in control. You're no. It's like, then something else is moving through your anyone else getting horny.

I am, yes. It feels so damn good. Like I can feel my hairs are standing up on end. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's just, it's so delicious and so delightful to let go and to surrender all of the, "it has to be this way". And I've only ever done this before. I've only ever had an orgasm in this way before, and I've only ever had sex in that way before.

And so if I do something else, it might mean I'm a slut. It might mean I'm all those fears, all those shames, all those guilt. You just worries. What about lemon? Orgasm? yeah, you just let all of that go and you let this other force move through you. It's very, very deep and powerful. If sex does become a part of your spiritual practice, like intercourse, sex, Up in inside, close up to a woman's cervix.

Think about that as like the temple, like then you have entered the temple. You have gone into this other realm, this mystical spiritual realm where this holy house of the goddess lives. And it's a wonderful place for a man to worship. It's a wonderful place for a woman to worship. It's a wonderful place for anyone to offer their prayer.

What are you praying for? Are you praying for your mother or father? Because they're dying of cancer. Are you praying for your niece or nephew? Because they're, you know, hooked on drugs. Are you, what are you praying for in your life? Are you praying for a miracle of money to come through, so you can purchase your home before it sells on the market?

You know, what are you praying for? How do you wanna bring that into your love making? Because love making sexuality is what creates new life. It creates a whole new human being, right? It has that potential. So it's the most potent creative life force synergy that we have access to. So, how do you wanna use your prayer to create the world around you?

Leah: Yeah, in fact, there's a whole system of what's referred to as sex magic within the Tantric, various Tantric methods that really helps you with manifesting one of two things, either of a secular nature or of a spiritual nature. You know, what are the qualities that you need to enhance your own sainthood patients?

You know, hope, faith, trust, vulnerability. I mean, there's all sorts of things that we can use sex and prayer to bring into yourself more qualities. That are going to make your life more bet. And then there's things within the whole manifestation realm that are secular in nature, like buying a new house or getting a new car or getting a new job or finding an answer.

Where's my love of my life. You know, there's, there's all sorts of ways to play with manifestation. We'll do a whole episode on that.

[00:34:52] Spiritual Sex that Sexually Heals You

Leah: I think what has made sex so spiritual for me is the healing aspect of it. Mm. I love the healing, the miraculous change in belief systems, the miraculous change in limiting belief systems.

What has been the most transformative is transforming self-loathing into self-love. Mm, so powerful, you know, which has a strong connection to self trust versus self-doubt, right? There's many pieces to that puzzle. And so once you come face to face with how you talk to yourself and your own private dark moment, and you recognize, I don't like that voice, that's not a kind voice in my mind that is hurting me.

That to me, when I could, I couldn't deny that voice, and it's volume any longer. And I knew I had to do something otherwise, something bad was gonna happen to me. It was really a life or death, felt like a life or death line. And I had no idea that it was gonna be sexuality that saved me. You know, the place for healing was deep inside of me.

And so being a woman with a female assigned genitals. There is that womb space. There is the Yoniverse, there is this, this experience of a chakra that you can touch the center of, which is so beautiful because we can't touch the center of all the Chakras. And when you were talking about, you know, that house, that temple right inside of the Yi, the, the temple that needed the most reverence in my body.

Yes, it was my Yi, but more so was my root chakra. Mmm. Yeah, because it was the root, that was what was shrouded, shrouded and darkness. And again, the root chakra, the anal cavity, there's all this pleasure and anal play and where so many of us are so terrified of it. We think it's gonna be gross. Mm-hmm, you know, we have maybe homophobic fear, like whatever our story is, this is gonna be a channel that.

We hope to normalize what is possible regarding anal pleasure. I needed a tremendous amount of healing in both places, but again, two Chakras, you get to touch the center of 

Willow: hallelujah. Amazing. And they are both the Chakras that connect you to being an earthling, being in a body. Right. And so I'm sure on your journey, Leah, that through that healing, you became more embodied.

You began to enjoy your body more and see yourself as beautiful. I've heard you say this before, so I know it's true. It's just, it's so powerful. So for you, it was this psychological healing and this physical healing all at the same 

Leah: time. So those two primal Chakras were incongruent with this other spiritual higher place.

And it wasn't until those two pieces met each other. And I could really tie the threads together that my wholeness emerged. So yes, it was like fully coming into my body and yes, it was fully healing and making peace that I was a sexual woman, despite my fear of being that kind of girl. But most importantly, it was the union between heaven and earth in me that the two have a place to dance and make love.

And I don't gotta wait to die to go 

Willow: and experience. Yeah, so beautiful. So super powerful. The, the medicine of sexuality really does open up these, these Chakras. And as Leah's saying, these two lower ones, like you can actually go into and like physically touch, you can touch the, the cervix. You can touch the root chakra.

And yeah, it opens up this whole line of energy inside of your body, that all your other shockers are connected to. And your shockers are the energetic mirror of your glands and your glands are your, your endocrine system. And we all know that hormones make you feel a lot of different emotions. And when you use sexuality to heal these Chakras, these glands, and open up this whole central column of light inside of your body, I love that description you had of how they met, and you became more whole than ever before.

That is absolutely available to anyone who's walking around in a. 

Leah: Yeah. And in fact, I think we forget that I, yes, there is a feeling being more whole, but I think what's even more true. The realization that I had is that I was always whole, I just forgot 

Willow: that's it? 

Leah: You know, it's more like I thought I was so broken.

Right. I wasn't, you know, I thought my innocent was taken from me, but guess what? It's still here. I just needed to uncover it. And I, so I think people think that something gets lost along the way. No, honey, it's not lost. It just gets covered up. And so it's a remembering 

Willow: that's right. Yeah, bringing these parts of yourself back into, into yourself, into your wholeness.

That is the, the dismembering has been happening for eons, right? It's been going on of like, you can be pretty, but you can't be smart. You can look this way, but you can't do that. And so we have been pulled apart and been, you know, made to be one way, but not the other. And that's a dismembering. So now with Tantric practice, with Taoist sexual practices, you get the opportunity to remember.

Yeah. I love that. My experience with, um, healing through spiritual sexuality was a little different. It was cuz I used to have, mine was more physical. It was like more of a physical into the, into the psychosomatic, spiritual, emotional side. I had horrific periods, like the kind where you would miss three or four days of school, and you'd be rolling around.

Floor and writhing in pain, pop and ibuprofen all day long and like barfing, like it was really bad, really, really bad. And had been checked for endometriosis that wasn't it, it wasn't all these, you know, it was all these things that it wasn't, it was just this stagnation in my body looking back on. And now I really truly believe it's because of the oppression of my creative energy.

Like it never got it, never got a seat at the table. My creative life force energy was just like, put like, just don't look at it. Don't pay attention to it. It's not really there, you know? And so that coagulated and stagnated the Chi in my body, which coagulated and stagnated the blood in my body, which is what cramps are coagulated and stagnate.

I went through all the, the physical healing, the Chinese medicine, the acupuncture, the herbs, everything under the sun I did. And it wasn't until, and it got better. It got better layers peeled away, but it wasn't until I started doing the Dowa sexual practices that it completely was eradicated. I mean, now my periods are smooth and easy.

When you have a period, the blood should be coming out like water, you know, there should not be clots. It should not be dark. It shouldn't be bright red and coming out like water. And for most women they're like, well, I've never had a period like that, you know? So, there was something so healing about doing those Dawa sexual practices on my own.

So that's really more in the vein. Of white Tantra and doing the practices on your own and moving that energy through your body on your own and cleaning up these pathways, these Meridian systems, these chakra systems in your body. That was the, the healing experience that I had, which then of course the physical body is the other side of the coin, this emotional, psychological side of your body.

And that's when things started to shift for me to come into that more wholeness, you know, all those layers got peeled away. And then there, I was just really more confident than I'd ever been before, more willing to let my authentic truth be seen and heard than ever before, without fear of judgment.

So I got to a point where I'm like, well, this is just what it is, you know? And at that point you start to attract people who like what is true about you. When you're not having to, you know, continue to hide these parts of you that are, that are false because you want someone to like you, yeah. That's a vast wards way of going about it.

So, you know, the healing journey of spiritual sexuality can go lots of different ways, lots of different ways. And -

Leah: people love this conversation too. How wonderful 

[00:44:02] Communicating "too much - too soon" 

Leah: There are also people who are extremely uncomfortable, and you can feel that what can somebody receive? What is kind, what it hurts yourself when you over expose something, cuz someone can't hear it.

And so I had to learn that it wasn't, that someone couldn't receive all of me. It was just that all of me can be very intimidating. 

Willow: Leah's a lot. I'll tell you now, I'm a big jar of cookies. So,

Leah: you know, I, if I don't wanna be rejected either. Right. So I, there was, there's a really elegant, beautiful learning of, of measurement, of knowing how much is too 

Willow: much.

Yeah. That's a really good point. And you know, when you start to get into spiritual sexuality, you are going, that's naturally going to occur. Mm-hmm like, don't worry about having to figure that out. There definitely are skills and methods, but it also is very organic and naturally occurring, and you'll make mistakes along the way.

You absolutely will put foot in your mouth. You'll walk away from a conversation and. Oh, boy, did I share too much? Was that right? An overshare? Was I the sled of that party or what? I don't know. You know, you'll just, you'll learn. You'll walk away, and you'll find that place of discernment inside of you, that same place that holds your authentic truth.

And, you know, if you go away from a conversation with a group of people, really feeling shame and, and guilt around what you shared, then that might be your body telling you that's not your group of people. Oh, You know, whereas if you walk away from a different group of people having said the exact same thing, feeling like, oh my God, it was so amazing to be received and to be able to have this conversation about what I'm going through.

And what's evolving inside of me in relationship to sexuality and spirituality and feeling uplifted, then that's your group of people. So you'll your discernment factor will get stronger. 

Leah: Yeah. And the only way to know that is to have experiences of it, and you'll delight when there's no boundaries to what you can share, because who you're speaking with is right there with you.

Yeah. That's best. And, and then you can also stop judging the people that can't go there with you. Yep. And, and it, and it doesn't have to hurt anymore. You can actually just love them right where they're at. Yep. I think one of the big spiritual teachings I had to. Come to terms with in this work is I was so alive with what was changing and healing and opening in me.

I thought everyone was supposed to have this right, but I was convinced if only everyone had 

Willow: this, she was born again, Tantra Chi of the 

Leah: world. We could live in totally born again. Tantra Rica. And it's, that's not true. It's not for everybody. 

Willow: Yeah. That's, that's a great point too. And you, you might go through that phase too, and it's okay if you do you know where you're like, yeah.

Everyone needs to know about the amazing healing power of sexuality and spirituality not everyone's 

Leah: gonna benefit from it. It's not for everybody. 

Willow: Yeah. Share your experience with, with those who you feel aligned with, and it might open up a doorway or a portal for them as well. 

[00:47:30] Spiritual Sex and Stillness

Willow: What are some components like when you're having a deep, spiritual sexual experience?

One of the things that comes up a lot is there's this, these long pauses, like these long moments of stillness, There's so much juice in those moments. Like there's so much depth of connection, no movement, no gyrating, no pumping, no humping is needed. It's just being in that moment of stillness, and you can hang out in that moment for a long time.

Leah: Most people have never truly visited stillness and sex and the amount of intimacy and cosmic. 

Willow: Oh, it's so 

Leah: circuitry that is possible and stillness is so powerful. 

Willow: It's totally delightful. You know, those are the moments where you're like, this isn't even really sex. This isn't even really intimacy. I don't know what this is, but it is divine.

It's divinity coming through you. And, so there's stillness. There's slowness. There's also fast-paced inside of spiritual sexuality. The energy is taking is having its way with you. Yeah. It's taking over, positions that you've never gotten into before are gonna happen. Things that you've never done before, but you're feeling totally safe and totally comfortable to explore them.

That's really what this container and this experience sets up for you, 

[00:48:59] Yoga of the Bedroom

Leah: You know, that reminds me one of the things that's a really beautiful phenomenon. If you are a Yogi, if you've practiced of having Asana practice, you will start to see how much Asana is played out in sex. Oh, yeah. There are incredible.

Our bodies are like these sacred geometry formations that can happen in love making. And when you bring certain yoga postures into the love making, I've got a video called "the love dance" and it, it, it totally shows the application of how the white Tantra, the yoga Asana practice coincides with the red Tantra, the sexual love making.

If you rate this episode, and you leave a comment, "Leah, I want the love dance". I'll make sure you, we, we reach out and get it to you. So let that be an incentive. If you wanna see how yoga and sex come together, baby, 

Willow: I got you covered. Oh my God. It's so true. They really do. And then, you know, time massage, if you've ever had time massages that can come into play as well or jujitsu or any kinda martial.

If you have the divine pleasure of being with a lover who has any kind of massage skill, yoga, skill jujitsu, any kind of, that kind of skill, then that is gonna weave its way into your session as well. Breath is gonna start taking over your body. Sounds are gonna start to come out of you that you have never made before.

And at first, when you start to make sounds, you've never made before. You can get a little bit like, Ooh, I don't know. Should I make that sound? Does that sound weird? Does that yeah. You start to self judged and wonder if the other person's judging you insecure. Yeah. But again, you cross this threshold, and you're like, I don't even can't even hear myself.

Doesn't matter. Just gotta make these sounds in order to make this pleasure roll through my body, the way that it wants to roll through. Yeah. You know, that reminds me of it. 

Leah: We've sort of touched on it already. 

[00:51:04] Sex as Meditation

Leah: That idea of that like love making is a prayer with your body meditation. Again, there's like sex can be a meditation too.

If, prayer, isn't your word, but you get meditation. Let this love making, be a moving meditation. Let yourself have an experience where you're separating the roles of giver and receiver. When you have enough practice separating, receiving, and giving, something phenomenal happens in sex. When you're both doing things at the same time, is that your awareness for subtlety and sensation grows exponentially, which means your cultivation of pleasure expands in a way that you cannot now imagine, cuz you've not tried it yet, right?

As you begin to separate those roles and your job as the receiver to simply meditate on sensation in what you're feeling, your awareness for these different levels of pleasure expands. When you know your job is just to be the giver. Your awareness to the sensation and to the pleasure that you can absorb through your touch, through your giving, through your licking and your sucking and your being this that expands your pleasure, potential tenfold, but it's not just the pleasure that expands your awareness of how you perceive the world is spirit.

And you know, it's not just that your body is housing. The spirit, your body, is spirit. It's just slower moving, denser spirit. And so all these things start to come together, but it requires a quiet mind to be able to sit still, to have that you prepare your nervous system to be able to stay focused. To feel all the things that need to be felt, even if something uncomfortable arises.

Willow: Yeah. I love that. You said that, you know, one of the, I love that you said that cuz right now in my life currently I have got about eight humongous projects going on all at once. So homegirl's mind over here is not so quiet. It's like I sit down to meditate and just sit there and think, you know, whatever, that's the list, right.

That's okay. I'm okay with that. That's what needs to happen. But when I have these, when I have these Tantric intimacy dates, that's when I get to go into the stillness of my mind. That's when I get to go into total presence with another soul and that other soul bringing a high level of presence to my plate, to my temple, it really makes it really just.

Creates this beautiful field and this beautiful opportunity for me to drop into that deeper stillness of the mind that meditative stays, where I'm getting the best meditation right now. And what 

Leah: else are you getting? What are the, the things that people don't know are the added benefits, 

Willow: right? Yeah. So, so this is what Lee is talking about.

I was like, you can't even imagine, right? So we want you, we wanna really help you imagine what's possible. That's what we're trying here. 

[00:54:14] Psychedelic Sex - The Church for Lovers

Willow: And right now what's happening for me is beyond sex. It's beyond intimacy. It's like intergalactic, interstitial space. Like both of us are practitioners have the body of the human body.

So we both know the Meridian systems and the acupuncture points and the psychological and spiritual connection between all of what it means. To be in a human body. And so what I'm walking away with is just this complete fucking renewal. Like it is an absolute reset to my entire system. My entire body makes me emotional.

I can feel the emotion coming up, you know? Oh, yeah. Yeah. It's just so deep and so powerful. And that place where Lingham and cervix are just like in the they're just kissing, you know, they're just in the deepest connection with each other that's church. That's the moment where it's like, nothing else.

This is all that matters. All that matters. All the other Minutian shit that I have to deal with in my life. It's just, it's gone. It's not even there. And then when I return to my 5 million billion amazing things that I'm transitioning through right now, I'm just so much more relaxed in such a deeper state of trust around all of it.

So it's, it's making the big transformation that I'm going through in my life. So much more pleasurable, enjoyable, and easy. And it's allowing me to feel more grace through it all. You know, it's one of my favorite Tantra sutras, you 

Leah: know, refers to that pleasure is this gift from  spirit because the human soul gets weary because the path of life is, can be so difficult.

We have so many reasons to feel anxious and depressed and upset, and yet here's pleasure to renew the weary soul. And so I'm just like imagining you coming to bed with your soul renewed and you having respite from that busy thinking problem, solving mind, you know, that's just got the list that never ends.

And it's 

Willow: beautiful. Oh, I'm so grateful for it. It's a game changer right now because otherwise I would probably be lost in some serious depression. I would probably be lost in a lot of stress for sure. And I would not have the, the state of, I would not have the state of trust that I have. I mean, that's one of the things that we've been exploring is like, what are you embodying?

So for intention setting for these sessions that we've been having, you know, mine has been trust I'm embodying that. And so to embody trust and to go through a Tantric experience with somebody, it's other worldly it's really, you said earlier, psychedelic it is. And the partner I'm practicing with right now looked at me.

Pause. Went into a moment of stillness looked at me and said, "being with you is being on like being on psychedelics" yeah. It's trippy man. And I've said yes. Ah, yeah. Yes it is. And it is sobers of stone, you know? So it's, and it there's and the chemicals inside of your body, back to my practitioner, mind the oxytocin and the, the testosterone and yes, opioids, all of those hormones.

I can't even thank you. Yes. They just flood and they that's what causes that sort of psychedelic feeling of transcending the body, but also being so present and in the body at the same. You know, I've always 

Leah: looked up to these friends of mine. In fact, one of them, I did my teacher trainings with, and they've been married for 30 plus years.

And every Sunday everyone knows don't call Cheryl or Earl until three o'clock on Sunday. Because they're at church, honey, they're not picking up the phone, love it. And church is their bedroom. They bring all their snacks inside, and they make love until three o'clock in the afternoon and making love to them.

Yeah, sometimes it's intercourse. Sometimes it's sacred spot massage usually includes a bath and feeding each other finger food and being in each other's delightful, undivided attention. And I love that. Like everyone in their life knows the kids. Now the best friends know the parents know they're at church.

Now nobody's picking up the phone and I, I think we have lost touch with some of that devotional time. There's a word, uh, in Sanskrit and it's the word? BTI and BTI means devotion, BTI, yoga, devotional, union. And there's, this is why I think these ancient art forms have so much meaning for us today, is because we don't have a representation of this in our own modern culture.

I think the reason why this like Eastern spiritual practice spoke to my heart is because growing up in my Christian upbringing and I converted to Catholicism at 11 years old, I got baptized into Catholicism, had to go to Catholic school after all that Pentecostal stuff born again, Christian stuff.

So the departure of going well, who are my role models of love two virgins Jesus, who I was raised believing was a Virgin and mother Mary was definitely a Virgin, but yet she was married. Oh, it turns out she did have some more kids, you know, there's just, it was so confusing. We don't have a model for sexual, spiritual love, and they do in the east.

And there was a homecoming there from my sweet little Christian heart that just needed somebody to look up to. I love that. Yeah. I go Southern every time. Don't mind 

Willow: me. She does. She goes weird. A couple in her. Oh my God. 

Leah: I'm not from the south, all but spiritually. I am. All right. 

Willow: All right. It's that?

Southern Pentecostal barrel. Yep. 

Leah: Well, this was fun. Thanks for dishing on

Willow: spiritual sex. Yeah. We'd love to hear any questions you have about your own journey. How to get started if you're already on it, you know what's coming up for you. We'd love to hear. We'd love to support you and just kind of, have a conversation with you about what's transpiring inside of your sexual, spiritual union inside of yourself and potentially inside of a relationship.

And it will also inspire us to bring more of that to the podcast. Yeah. 

Leah: I, I would love to know if you would be interested in sort of the anatomy of a sexual spiritual date night, where we could kind of take you through some steps, like a, you know, 10 steps to a full experience, things that you could bring to the table and sort of have a roadmap 

Willow: for.

Awesome. Then we will, uh, look forward to seeing you next time. Thanks for tuning in. If the hosts seem to know what they were talking about. That's because they do Leah Piper is a Tantric sex master coach and a positive psychology facilitator. Dr. Willow brown is both a Chinese and functional medicine doctor and a Taoist sexology teacher.

Don't forget your comments likes subscribes and suggestions matter. Let's realize this new world together.